Isa
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Post by Isa on Nov 2, 2006 10:44:53 GMT -5
Let's get this thing started!
CHAPTERS 1-5
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bastet
First piece published in the school’s newspaper
Posts: 61
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Post by bastet on Nov 2, 2006 12:54:40 GMT -5
Ok, I only own the German version so I can't give you English quotes. Personally, I thought the most disgusting scene in the whole book (and there were quite a few) was the one in chapter 3 where Sueskind describes how Grenouille "sniffs out" Father Terrier. Which expression do they use in the English version? The whole paragraph made me shudder. I can't really put my finger on what's so creepy about it. I think we all know how babies smell (of baby powder mainly ) and it seems so disgusting that having no scent of his own Grenouille also appears to lack the innocence and sweetness of a little child. Anybody else?
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Bina
First novel published
Posts: 2,472
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Post by Bina on Nov 2, 2006 14:17:40 GMT -5
I think I´ll get the English translation for this thread. Might be easier to keep up. You´re so right about the disgusting scenes, there were so many. Personally I thought the description of Paris was nauseating, very accurate but really ewww!
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neh
Collection of short stories published by an independent editor
"I live in two worlds; one is a world of books"
Posts: 943
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Post by neh on Nov 2, 2006 14:23:24 GMT -5
I personally found the whole birthing scene on the first page, where the poor kid basically drops out and she leaves him on the ground and goes back to cutting up fish - i found that disgusting, both morally and in terms of just really vomit-inducing imagery, with sights and smells in particular... it really is an engineering oddity that Baptiste has NO scent.........
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bastet
First piece published in the school’s newspaper
Posts: 61
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Post by bastet on Nov 2, 2006 15:15:55 GMT -5
Yeah the matter of fact way it was described that she'd done it with the previous babies, too- just swept them away with the fish guts at the end of the day.. yuck.
I think the sniffing scene puts me off because the behaviour is so unbabylike. You really get the feeling of that little tick waiting to grow into a disgusting monster. I think they did really well adapting this scene in the movie. I've got another question- is Sueskind's Perfume well-known in the US? Over here it's more or less on the high school reading list.
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Post by bookaddict on Nov 2, 2006 15:57:14 GMT -5
The smelling scenes were deeply disturbing. I find it ironic that the baby does not smell like a "human child." All his smells seem very generic, so if he does not smell like them then he has to be different. It was very creepy to have everyone afraid of the infant, and wanting to get rid of him. The only person that could take care of him was Madame Gaillard who has no sense of smell, and who is numb to all feelings. She basically gives him minimal care, and that's all he wants.
The analogy of him as a tick was very interesting, and the fact that he has red hair. Red is usually described as the devil's color.
I find it interesting that he is not a smart child, and he is "feebleminded." I feel that the baby perfectly describes the stereotype of a murderer. He does not fear the dark or night, and learns to be comfortable in the dark and use his sense of smell to get around.
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Kristie
Novel turned into BBC miniseries
"If a book is well written, I always find it too short."
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Post by Kristie on Nov 2, 2006 18:43:37 GMT -5
I think one of the reasons the scenes whenGrenouille intensly describes things by smell is so disgusting is because we never noticed how things smelled before. Like what he's smelling is really there, but we just move past that sense and don't really think about things that we smell all the time. I think it would be really annoying to never be able to turn off the olfactory sense. But if you can't smell, can you taste? Those senses are linked and when you plug your nose you can't taste as well.
The last part of the 2nd chapter, where the wet nurse describes what a baby smells like, I found to be really odd. Like What a Baby Smells Like 101 or something. I agree with you, bastet, about how babies really smell like baby powder, or maybe formula. But what the wet nurse describes arejust weird smells.
People seemed to be able to peg Grenouille really well. Like Father Terrier and the children at Mme Gaillard's who were all creeped out by him. And isn't it weird that he has like a photographic memory, only it's not sight, it's smell. He can remember everything he's smelled before. That would drive me nuts, seriously. Smell would be the worst sense to be intensified and highlighted, I think.
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bastet
First piece published in the school’s newspaper
Posts: 61
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Post by bastet on Nov 2, 2006 19:07:33 GMT -5
Something I wanted to throw in- in German, if you don't like somebody you say "I can't smell him/her". Actually it doesn't mean not being able to smell somebody, but that you can't bear it. I wonder whether the scentless Grenouille originated in this phrase.
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neh
Collection of short stories published by an independent editor
"I live in two worlds; one is a world of books"
Posts: 943
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Post by neh on Nov 2, 2006 20:31:15 GMT -5
The more i read the comments on Grenouille on this thread, the more i understand why the film-makers would have yearned to humanize the bloke a little... for in moments we're speaking of him as though he's the "ultimate evil" - and i'm one of those readers who even seeks to find reasoning and sympathy behind villians like Voldy. I think the idea behind our protagonist here is that he both lacks the emotion and the desire to care for/comprehend what is right and wrong... it's not as though he goes about killing because he knows he's being naughty and it's oh-so-fun..... although i'm quite sure he knows that most people don't take pleasure in extracting scent from dead girls.... I know that no-one has said or insinuated this, and i understand that the man is still one whacked and tragic and freaky individual.. i was just trying to play therapist for a moment! hehe...too bad i stink at it... (no pun intended by the stink thing)
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Post by Dominique on Nov 2, 2006 23:31:50 GMT -5
I found it interesting that the baby is described and is, so basely evil, but his life so far has also been so desloate that he could turn out that way anyway. His mother leaves him for dead, everyone hates him, a priest abandons him and he's raised by a woman who has had her sensitivity and tenderness literally knocked out of her. But then "for his soul he required nothing" anyway. Seems ironic.
The analogies in these chapters were excellent I thought, like the tick one that someone has already mentioned. I think the character plays a lot on people's fears of being exposed. He drinks in everything around him in a selfish and greedy way, absorbing it into his body, while ommitting no smell himself with which people can analyse him back.
I also thought it was ironic that someone so obsessed with the sense of smell, something often thought to be a soulful thing, is so foul and evil. He doesn't take joy in smell the same way one of us would, he sucks in everything about the world, it's sorrows, joys and grotesque aspects, and yet he feels nothing but a deep seated lust for more things to smell.
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neh
Collection of short stories published by an independent editor
"I live in two worlds; one is a world of books"
Posts: 943
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Post by neh on Nov 2, 2006 23:54:59 GMT -5
I would feel for him (Grenouille) were it not for the sneaking suspiscion i get that Sueskind really doesnt want us to!
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Isa
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Post by Isa on Nov 3, 2006 9:10:05 GMT -5
The analogy of him as a tick was very interesting, and the fact that he has red hair. Red is usually described as the devil's color. Being a red-head myself, I also picked up on that. It's like Suskind truly wants the reader to understand that there's something evil with that child! To begin on a more general note, I have to say I really like the tone of the novel. I like how Suskind is mixing monstruosity with comic irony. Like when he says that Grenouille's mother was a great girl, really, despite having the gout and syphilis and what not. And also when he describes how Mme Gaillard died in a public hospital, when they only thing she had ever wanted in life was to die at home. The first chapter also sets the tone of the story really well with all those nasty, smelly descriptions. I too was shocked at the idea that four little babies had been born and left to die at the market, swept away in the sewers. And now for Grenouille. Since I'm a fan of gothic fiction, I love how Suskind describes his main character. His first sound sent his mother to the gallows, that's a really good start! And I agree, the scene where he breathes in Terrier's smell is pretty scary. The way it's described, it's as though Grenouille is sucking in Terrier's soul. And after Terrier gets rid of the child, he strips down and washes himself, like he's been raped or violated somehow and wants to wash it away. I like what you said, Poisonpen, about Grenouille taking everything in and not giving anything back, not even a smell. Then when Grenouille goes to live with Mme Gaillard, the other kids feel cold when they're around him, which is also linked to the devil. And to top it all off, Grenouille feels perfectly fine in the dark. Short of saying he had a tail and little horns, Suskind couldn't paint a more devilish picture! To answer your question bastet: I don't know about the US but in Canada I had to read this book in college so yes, it's pretty popular.
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Isa
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Post by Isa on Nov 4, 2006 12:26:42 GMT -5
Perhaps we can move on to Chapters 6-10? But feel free to comment on the previous chapters!
What struck me in those chapters is the way Grenouille is described: he's no longer the son of the devil, he's more like an animal. He's certainly treated like one in Chapter 6 by Grimal, who makes him work like a beast and makes him sleep on the ground. After Grenouille gets over that deadly disease, his status somewhat improves but he still remains an animal, since we are told that Grimal now thinks of him as a useful pet.
Then the whole scene leading to the murder is depicted very much like a hunt. First off, we are told that Paris has become his territory, and when he first catches the smell of his victim, he tracks her down through the streets of Paris pretty much like a wolf would track down its prey in the woods. He manages to sneak up on her like a predator and when I read how he stripped her of her clothes and devoured her smell from head to toe, I couldn't help but think about the images we see on the Discovery channel of wolves savagely devouring their prey...
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Kristie
Novel turned into BBC miniseries
"If a book is well written, I always find it too short."
Posts: 7,214
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Post by Kristie on Nov 4, 2006 12:44:54 GMT -5
I thought it was interesting how Grimal treated Grenouille like an animal, as Jefi mentioned. It seems that he is really like a dog of some sort because of his heightened sense of smell. It's interesting how he's able to survive such a deadly disease, but it turned out to not really help him because, sure he became more valuable, but he then had to do the most dangerous work that a skilled worker couldn't be afforded to lose doing.
I thought the scene when Grenioulle first smells the sea was interesting. It was interesting that he could pull apart all the scents that made up the smell of the sea, but it turned out they smelled better together. After he decided that some scents are better left as a whole, he starts concoting new smells in his head by combining things, so I think this was a turning point because it almost made him want to be a perfumer.
I agree with Jefie on the smell of "pure beauty" scene with the young girl. I hadn't thought so much about the animal-like habits he's evolving, but I really thought more about a strange stalker in the middle of the night like Jack the Ripper. But it's odd having the viewpoint of the killer, not some person trying to find out who the killer is. I've never read a novel like this before.
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bastet
First piece published in the school’s newspaper
Posts: 61
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Post by bastet on Nov 4, 2006 13:20:49 GMT -5
Good point about the animal-like behaviour! Another general observation- throughout the whole book I never even once felt for Grenouille. Starting from the baby scenes I felt disgusted and the end of the book was almost like a releif. There was not a single moment I felt sorry for him, not one scene where I could relate to him, still the book was so thrilling that I couldn't put it away until I was finished. I think it's really quite an achievement to create a main character people don't like and will most likely not identify with but still keep people reading to the last page.
ETA- I can't find the thread where suggestions for the next bookclub book go. Could somebody please point me there!
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