Kristie
Novel turned into BBC miniseries
"If a book is well written, I always find it too short."
Posts: 7,214
|
Post by Kristie on Nov 24, 2006 14:43:57 GMT -5
ummm...around chapter 36 from my notes...after he leaves his mountain hovel
|
|
|
Post by bookaddict on Nov 24, 2006 15:57:35 GMT -5
Hoping I get there soon.
|
|
Isa
Administrator
Posts: 6,995
|
Post by Isa on Nov 25, 2006 19:27:44 GMT -5
lol, can't wait for the murders to begin, eh?! I have to agree with all of you, I also thought the mountain scene wasn't as exciting as the rest of the book. But it almost feels like some kind of wicked rite of passage, a bit like when Heatcliff goes away for a while (for those of you who have read Wuthering Heights) and then he comes back and he's completely changed - and not for the best! This scene also brings out yet again his animal-like characteristics, like the fact that despite his heightened sense of smell, his taste buds aren't exactly well developed and he'll basically eat anything that comes his way, pretty much like a dog.
I also picked up on the fact that again a character dies not entirely because of Grenouille but in relation to him. It seems quite obvious that Suskind wants us to know that there's something evil about Grenouille, something that Grenouille himself has no control over.
|
|
Isa
Administrator
Posts: 6,995
|
Post by Isa on Nov 26, 2006 9:04:12 GMT -5
Chapters 26-30
Again the action was a bit slow in those few chapters, until Grenouille left the mountain. He discovered that he had no smell, and also came to realize that the smell of the young girl he had killed still was his favorite smell in the world, putting everything in place for what is about to happen.
I thought Chapter 30 was a lot more interesting though. When Grenouille meets with the mayor, he's once again taken under the man's wing and you can't help but wonder if this guy is also going to die, like Baldini and Grimal before him. Also, from the beginning of the book, I'd been wondering when a transformation would occur because of Grenouille's name (which means "frog"). A frog usually is a symbol of transformation, as in the fairy tales when the pretty princess kisses the frog and it turns out to be a prince. In this case, Grenouille is put in a machine for five days, and he's then dressed and groomed properly, and we clearly see that from being an animal-like being, he becomes an almost normal human being - at least he looks the part, and we feel like it's going to have a drastic influence on his behavior henceforth.
|
|
czarval
Collection of short stories published by an independent editor
Posts: 607
|
Post by czarval on Nov 28, 2006 13:00:03 GMT -5
I really liked the part with the "scientist" nobleman. It really captures what a lot of noblemen at the time were doing with themselves.
|
|
Kristie
Novel turned into BBC miniseries
"If a book is well written, I always find it too short."
Posts: 7,214
|
Post by Kristie on Nov 28, 2006 15:10:30 GMT -5
Chapters 26-30 So I thought this was an interesting time in G's life. Towards the beginning he's still in his mountain cave and his living here sort of reminded me of Frankenstein a little. I mean, from what I remember of Frankenstein, the monster lived for some time in a hill or something observing a family that lived in a cottage. I probably compared the two books because the monster, in some ways, is like G. They're both searching for something, although G has no desire to be loved and accepted, just to conquer. They have to hide to become closer to reality it almost seems. Frankenstein's monster could only observe real life by hiding his appearance and G seemed to, for some reason, realize the reality of his sense when there was a sterile environment. They both chase and flee and, chasing their dreams of perfection (being accepted/loved and creating the perfect scent) and they have to flee humankind to do so.
I found the bit about G drowning in his own nonexistent scent rather interesting. I mean, I wouldn't want to have a scent for my own body if I couldn't turn off my powerful olfactory sense because it'd drive me crazy. He lived for most of his life in Paris and he could always smell something that was always there, so why he tried to convince himself he was immune to his own scent was just ridiculous. He couldn't be immune to one scent because he has a "photographic" memory for scents. If he never had a smell in the back of his mind of what he smelled like, he never smelled at all.
I think Jefie brings up an excellent point about the transformation. I knew that Grenouille meant "frog" in French (thanks to a Boy Meets World episode haha), but I hadn't linked it to the transformation of animal to human in fairy tales. Just didn't make that excellent observation (kudos, Jefie!). This bit of G being transformed reminds me of another book (one I've not yet read). When G was transformed my Marquis de La Taillade-Espinasse (gonna call him TE) it reminded me, again of Frankenstein but also of Tarzan. In Frankenstein, Frankenstein exhibits his monster to his fellow scientists so they can see what a marvelous and miraculous thing he's accomplished, like TE. But TE said, "You were a beast and I have made a man of you," which reminds me of Tarzan being transformed into a human by learning elementary things. G didn't need to be taught so much, but he did learn quite a bit about what a man is supposed and expected to do. I just found it interesting how G made such a turn around and he, for a moment, didn't seem so animal like. But it's odd that he was animal-like before he did the horrible things he does when he's more human-like.
|
|
|
Post by bookaddict on Nov 28, 2006 15:16:24 GMT -5
I also liked Jefie's point about the frog. I don't have much more to say about these chapters. It seems to already have been said.
|
|
Isa
Administrator
Posts: 6,995
|
Post by Isa on Nov 28, 2006 19:05:06 GMT -5
Thanks, you guys bring out the best in me But seriously, I think it's quite interesting how this passage that seemed a bit slow and pointless while we were reading it brings us to make all these connections with other stories...
|
|
Kristie
Novel turned into BBC miniseries
"If a book is well written, I always find it too short."
Posts: 7,214
|
Post by Kristie on Nov 29, 2006 15:03:53 GMT -5
does anyone see the connections i made? lol i wasn't sure if i was just imagining them or not...
|
|
Isa
Administrator
Posts: 6,995
|
Post by Isa on Nov 29, 2006 16:20:30 GMT -5
I sure do! like I said, I really think there's more to that scene than what seems like at first. It's sort of a pivotal moment that often exists in literature... it's just that other writers have made it more interesting (I think).
|
|
Kristie
Novel turned into BBC miniseries
"If a book is well written, I always find it too short."
Posts: 7,214
|
Post by Kristie on Nov 29, 2006 16:21:32 GMT -5
haha i agree
|
|
|
Post by Dominique on Nov 29, 2006 21:14:47 GMT -5
lol yeah I agree too, a page summary of that section of the book would have sufficed for me!
Chapters 30-35 Ok so in this section we see the continuation of G's transformation, the most important part of this transformation I thought was the realisation that he must be able to walk among other people unnoticed in order to conquer them. I think he realises this before this section, but the transformation continues as he walks among people in the wedding procession etc etc. Essentially, I think he goes from one kind of monster to a worse kind of monster. Originally people knew to fear him, they could recognise something about him wasn't quite right. Now he's more dangerous in that people's guard aren't up. He's become a true danger and a true monster in that he can prey on people without their suspicion.
There was a really good quote on pg 161 I thought kind of summed up the whole idea of the book:
"For people could close their eyes to greatness, to horrors, to beauty and their ears to melodies or decieving words. But they could not escape scent. For scent wAs a brother of breath. Together with breath it entered human beings, who could not defend themselves against it, not if they wanted to live. And scent entered into their very core, went directy to their hearts, and decided for good and all between affection and contempt, disguist and lust, love and hate. He who ruled scent ruled the hearts of men."
Also in this section there's a lot of comment on the ridiculousness of science during this time period. I think it's blatantly obvious that anyone who spends 7 years in a cave eating only moss and dead bats is going to have some health problems: muscele depletion due to lack of movement, malnourishment etc. The idea that bad gases from the earth have harmed G is uterly ridiculous and reflects the superstitous and myth ridden nature of science during the 1700's.
The part where G thinks the crowd is cheering him not because of his recovery but because of how he smells seems a bit over the top to me. I mean I know he's drenched in the perfume but would that many people in a crowded auditorium really be able to smell him.
Then we have the Marquis' pilgramage up a mountain, similar to G's period in solitude but of course based on the ridiculous notion of evil earth gases. This seems very religious in nature, it refers to his followers, but it is done in a very mocking way. I thought this was interesting since G's solitude thingy was made out to be so important.
In this section I really felt the story speeding up and gathering momentum.
|
|
Isa
Administrator
Posts: 6,995
|
Post by Isa on Nov 30, 2006 8:50:10 GMT -5
Essentially, I think he goes from one kind of monster to a worse kind of monster. Originally people knew to fear him, they could recognise something about him wasn't quite right. Now he's more dangerous in that people's guard aren't up. He's become a true danger and a true monster in that he can prey on people without their suspicion. I'm not done reading this section yet but I agree with your analysis so far - In Chapter 31, after Grenouille puts on the perfume, he says he's not afraid of other people anymore, and I think that makes him even more dangerous than before.
|
|
|
Post by bookaddict on Dec 1, 2006 14:44:50 GMT -5
I was interested in the number 7. It pops up frequently in these chapters. He is on his mountain for 7 years, and suskind repeats the number 7 often. This is what I found:
The Number 7 has for ages been regarded as the Number of mystery relating to the spiritual side of things. It may be remarked that all through the Bible and other sacred books, the seven, whenever mentioned, always stands in relation to the spiritual or mysterious God force, and has a curious significance in this sense whenever employed
So I was thinking that the number is significant. Grenouille certainly is mysterious. It does seem to me that Grenouille has no control over his sense of smell, and it seems like he never has any control over himself. It seems like he is driven by something inside him. When Grenouille became aware of the fact that he has no smell...it is said that he was "vomit[ed] back out into the world." Again, it is not his choice, but a forced action. Grenouille does seem to have a god-like presence around him. Although he does not directly kill anyone, people who have been in contact with his die after he leaves. Through the novel so far I feel like Grenouille is just trying to survive. From the time that he is an infant he's been an outcast. He doesn't truely understand himself.
Does anyone see what i'm trying to explain lol?
|
|
czarval
Collection of short stories published by an independent editor
Posts: 607
|
Post by czarval on Dec 2, 2006 1:28:40 GMT -5
I do see what you're trying to say, and it makes sense. But it doesn't really fit with how he acts later on.
|
|